A Mystery Entity Wants Their Gold NOW! (Uncut) 02-25-2025

“Off the Radar”: A Mystery Entity Wants Their Gold NOW!

Why have Comex gold deliveries gone mad? We’re going to try and get to the bottom of it today. One thing we know for sure, someone wants their gold and they want it now. Here to help us figure out what’s going on in this crazy market, former Swiss banker Clive Thompson joins me now.

Clive, always good to be with you. Good evening, Daniela, and thank you very much for having me on your show. Yes, I know it’s very late there for you, but there’s a sense of urgency here.

We have to get you on. What is going on with Comex gold? So something is going crazy. If you look at what’s been going on every month, we have a every time that gold should settle, you have the futures traded a premium.

I think that premium gradually trades down to zero as we reach the settlement month. But this month, the pattern has changed. It’s gone completely crazy.

In other words, the premiums are off the scale. So it makes sense for anybody who happens to have the right size bars in New York to sell the future and collect 6 or 7 percent or a lot more in some cases in terms of premium annualized. So what I think is going on, I think, first of all, lots of people have been trying to get their bars out of London, which are 400 ounce bars, the wrong size, and have them delivered to New York so they can take advantage of this large premium which exists on the futures.

So the futures are trading at an unusual, unusually high premium. What does that mean? It means that someone somewhere has been buying the futures or still is actually, and they’re pushing the futures to a level which is making no sense relative to the spot level. So what does that make sense to an arbitrager like a bank, for example? It makes sense to buy the spot gold if you can lay your hands on it and you’ve got to lay your hands on the right size bars in New York in the right place and then sell the future.

So it’s a risk free arbitrage for a bank or a hedge fund to do that. But the trouble is those bars which were in London and are supposed to be delivered to New York can’t get there on time. So now we have people who’ve been shorting the market and saying, oh, my God, I was fully hedged.

I had my bars in London, which were being probably lent out to earn another 6% a year. I never expected to have to deliver my bars. I expect to just keep rolling forward in the futures.

And suddenly, I’m expected to deliver because of the way the prices are going. What can I do? I’ll move my bars from London to New York. Oh, dear.

London can’t move them. There’s a lorry stuck in the drive, or they’re too heavy, or who knows what the problem is. But there’s a problem.

The bars can’t move in time. So what am I going to do? I have no choice. I have to buy back.

The future I sold short is coming to maturity. I have to buy it back and roll it into the next quarter. So we’ve got something very unusual going on.

But behind the scenes, the price of gold continues to rise. What does that mean? It means there’s a party unknown who is increasing or buying into the futures and asking for delivery. Someone somewhere is asking for delivery.

Now, if you look at the deliveries that we’ve seen in the month of February, the delivery notices, it’s off the radar screen. If I go back to a normal delivery month. So if we go back to February 24.

Yeah, I think you’re I think in one of your messages, I saw delivery notices are up 177% compared to February of last year. Yeah, it’s now you’re right. It’s now 255% up.

Oh, my goodness. So the deliveries in February 2024 were 20,754. February 2025 were up to 73,624.

That’s as far as I could tell. I’ve only gone back a few years, but it looks to me like an all time record in deliveries. We’ve never seen Comex investors demanding delivery of so many bars.

We don’t know who they’re going to, but those bars are being delivered. And someone somewhere is getting them and what they’re doing with them, we don’t know. But we’ve gone from, as I say, from a normal normalised 20,000 in February to 73,000.

If I just run through the major delivery months from last year, I’ll do it. So I’m starting with December, going through to December this year, 15,000, 20,000, 18,000, 30,000, 22,000, 12,000, 25,000 and suddenly February 73,000. So you can see the huge leap.

It’s completely off the scale and completely abnormal. So, you know, we don’t fully know why that’s happening. Of course, there’s an arbitrage to be had and the banks are taking advantage of it, the hedge funds are taking advantage of it.

There’s two things which could be going on. First of all, Trump has threatened to impose tariffs. I don’t think they’ll be imposed on gold.

There’s absolutely no reason whatsoever to put tariffs on gold or silver, because the reason you put tariffs is to protect the local industry. Now, the gold industry in the United States doesn’t need protecting. It’s not like China is dumping gold on America at half price.

So there’s no reason to put a tariff on gold at all. You’re not protecting the local industry, and it’s not a nascent brand new industry which needs protecting either. So the only thing that tariffs on gold would do would be to increase the taxes for the United States.

Of course, that would put up the price of gold. But it’s unlikely to happen. People have said, maybe the trigger for this was people said, I better get my gold into New York before it’s too late.

But logically, that should have suppressed the price of gold in New York, not made it trade at a higher price than everywhere else, which is what we have. So saying that it’s people moving gold to New York because they’re worried about tariffs, it could be that could be the catalyst. But someone somewhere is now taking that delivery and they’re taking that gold.

So in simple terms, we’ve gone to a record level of deliveries of gold in the month of February. Someone somewhere is taking delivery of that gold. We don’t know who it is.

My suspicion is it might be China. But there are rumors that it might be the Federal Reserve. It might be the Treasury.

Obviously, there’s some questions being asked as to whether the Treasury has got all the gold that it says it has. I have no reason to suppose that’s not correct. But there’s a lot of people who suspect it’s not there.

And there’s a lot of rumors out there. And they’re going to audit it. So what we’ve got is the problem of getting the logistics of getting the gold, the 400 ounce bars from London to New York, converting them into 100 ounce bars to be delivered, because nobody ever expected that to happen.

The futures traders, the ones who are selling short, just expected that they continue to roll the futures one after the other. And if the push came to the shelf, they could ask London to deliver the bars to New York and it would arrive in two days and everything would be fine. But here’s the problem.

Those bars aren’t arriving. And the price of gold is rising because someone somewhere is asking for those bars. Now, it could be a short squeeze.

People are saying, right, someone’s got a problem. They haven’t got the gold. Let’s squeeze them.

Let’s demand delivery of gold they haven’t got. And that forces them into the market to buy back the spot price. But logically, if that was the only thing that’s happening, they’d be buying back the spot and selling the future, which would mean that the premium of the future wouldn’t exist anymore.

But the premium is still there. So something very, very odd is going on in the gold market. Looks like something is breaking, but we’ll have to wait and see what’s going to if there’s something we don’t know.

OK, few points, because you just said many important things. One, you say your suspicion is it’s the central bank of China that wants that gold. Why do you think that? Well, China’s been buying gold.

It’s bought gold over the last three months. And clearly, it’s got a lot less gold per citizen than the United States. So the United States has got about 0.75 ounces of gold per U.S. citizen.

China has got a tiny fraction. I think it’s like 0.2 or 0.1 percent ounces of gold per citizen. So if they want to be on a par with the United States in terms of the amount of gold they’ve got in their foreign exchange reserves, they have to buy an awful lot.

And so I think that’s first of all, I think they could be on a mission to do it. And if you’re on a mission to do it, you want to do it before everybody else does it. But everybody can see what China is doing.

So I think that the central banks around the world are starting to look at this and say, well, let’s take the lead from China and maybe we should buy some. Last year in 2024, we had I think it was 27 central banks were net buyers of gold. And with the exception of Poland, who is one of the big buyers, almost all of those central banks who are buying gold were not the best friends of the United States.

So why is this happening? I think the weaponization of the U.S. dollar has caused a lot of countries around the world to rethink the ratio between gold they hold and U.S. dollars they hold, because if you happen to hold dollars or treasuries, they could be frozen with a flick of a switch. Whereas if you hold gold physically and you’ve got it in your home country, you can move it around to pay for your goods and services if the push comes to the shove. So I think that there’s a tendency from central banks, and that it does include China, and that’s why I’m thinking that could be them, to say, let’s reduce our exposure to treasuries in favor of gold.

And we can see that happened last year. In 2024, 85 percent of the increase of China’s reserves was attributable to gold for two reasons. First of all, net gold purchases, and secondly, the general rise in the gold price.

So despite the gold price being at an all-time record, China continued to buy, even though it meant that almost all the new reserves they were getting was going into gold. So very little appetite from China to invest into U.S. treasuries at the moment. I mean, this is in line with, you know, two news items we saw this month.

Yikai, a Chinese news agency reporting Chinese banks running out of gold, a soaring prices sparked this buying frenzy. This is at the retail level, now I’m speaking. What I think is interesting, though, Clive, is, yeah, it’s no doubt the central bank demand is there.

But from what I hear, the retail investor, at least in North America, hasn’t shown up. And yet we saw another news item this week that Herreyes has suspended the selling of certain size gold bars because they’re experiencing a shortage. So you’re right.

There’s no evidence that I’ve seen that the retail investors anywhere are getting involved in the gold market. I think they are to some extent in China. But I think that’s been a bit up and down.

So right now, I’d say it’s down because the Chinese are showing a little bit of the private investors in China showing a little bit of reluctance to pay the highest prices ever. But they were quite heavy buyers a few months ago. Shanghai Gold was trading at a premium to New York Gold.

Now it’s pretty much on a level. The reason why Chinese investors are interested in gold is traditionally the way you save in China was through real estate. You buy a second apartment, a third apartment, a fourth apartment.

And that was the way of saving. But suddenly, all these apartments can’t be sold. They’re all empty.

And the banks, you still have to pay the interest on the on the loans you’ve taken out to buy these apartments. So the real estate market, residential real estate market has collapsed. And nobody is buying apartments anymore as a way of saving because there’s no reason for them to go up when those apartments are actually empty and the population is forecast to fall.

So what’s going on? They’re looking for other things to buy. Now, they could go to the stock market, but the stock market isn’t exactly booming at the moment with the I mean, it has had a little bit of a jump in the last week or two, but it’s not really booming because some of the largest companies in China have been somewhat wrapped over the knuckles for becoming too powerful and kind of been taken down a bit. So the stock market is pretty much in a recession.

So they’re looking around for other places to go. And of course, the one way you can invest in China is either if you join up with the Shanghai Gold Exchange as a private investor, which you’re allowed to do. And I think there’s tens of thousands of millions of people who’ve done that.

You can buy gold there. Or the more common way to buy it in China is to walk into a jewellery shop where you can buy lots of gold items which are priced according to the price of gold per gram. So all you pay is the gold price plus the tax plus what’s called a labour charge.

So every item in the store has got its weight and the labour charge. So you look at the weight, you multiply the weight by the price of the wall, which is the price per gram of gold, add the labour charge, and that’s what you pay. So you know exactly when you’re in a Chinese gold shop.

You know exactly how much gold you’re getting for your money. And you know that if you sell it back, you won’t recuperate the labour charge or the taxes for that matter. But at least you know what the tangible value of the item you’re buying is.

I think that’s a very nice way and it’s a very open way to sell gold, unlike what we have in the West where you walk into a jewellery shop and they’ve got all their gold items, but you have no clue unless you have a pair of scales, you’re quite smart and can work it out. You’ve got no clue as to what the value of the gold in the item you’re buying is in the West. But in China, they know exactly what it is.

So it’s become a way of saving for the Chinese people to invest in gold. And it’s not everybody, it’s a very small percentage, but that’s enough to drive a flow of gold into China at the moment. Just to wrap this COMEX discussion before we move on here, is that for the folks at home, right, like the US or Canadian gold investor, or even the European you know, investor.

Okay, great. There’s something crazy happening in the COMEX. How does this affect them? What should they be doing? Well, I think we need to turn, we need to turn look at what’s happening with inflation, Daniela, because the inflation is the friend of gold.

And inflation is ticking up now. If you look at the official numbers from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and this is the percentage changes in the CPI for all consumers, US city average. It’s a table I sent to you earlier.

And I look at the monthly changes, we go back to July last year, monthly change 0.1, August 0.2, September 0.2, October 0.2, November 0.3, it’s going up, October 0.4. Sorry, October was 0.2, November was 0.3, December 0.4, January 0.5. Now those are the monthly increase, not the annualized increases. So month by month after month, the price of consumer goods, the CPI index, is rising on a monthly basis. So we’re now in a situation where that goal of getting to 2% inflation has gone.

It’s not going to happen. We’re seeing a gradually rising inflation. And if you want to know what’s going to happen, you only have to look at the CRB index, the Commodity Research Bureau index, its full name is the Thomson Reuters Core Commodity CRB Excess Return Index.

And you can see that over the course of the last 12 months, that’s up about 18%. So commodities, which would be things like pork bellies, it’ll be things like milk, cheese, all kinds of commodities, they are trading at much higher prices than a year ago. And that will take time, but it will come through to the Retail Price Index, the Consumer Price Index.

So inflation is on its way back. And as inflation comes back, people are going to start to look at ways to protect themselves from inflation. The obvious way to do that is holding gold.

So what should the consumer in America be doing? If they have zero gold, now is the time to have some. And for the current gold holder, I mean, you say, get your gold before it’s all gone. So you’re saying this speaks directly to people who have paper gold contracts? Well, the gold won’t be all gone.

It’s just a question of the price you have to pay for it. It might become more difficult to get gold at today’s prices, because the premiums could increase when you go to a coin dealer or a gold shop, or you might find that there’s delays. I mean, I can recollect in the 2008 banking crisis, we had a lot of clients were ringing my bank and saying, I’d like you to buy gold bars, I don’t trust the bank, it could go bust tomorrow.

And normally, we could get the gold bars within 24 hours from the refiners. But suddenly the refiners were turning to us and saying, well, sorry, there’s a two week waiting list. So the client would buy the gold bar, we’d fix the price, no problem.

But the client was at risk for two weeks while we waited for that bar to be delivered, because you never knew if the banking system was going to fail in those two weeks. And so we could get into the situation where you want your gold, but you bought some online or whatever you’ve done, and you can’t get it because the person or the company you bought it from is still waiting for their deliveries to come in. But there’s clearly a shortage starting to occur in the gold market at the moment.

It may be only temporary. Yeah, what do you say when you say if you don’t own gold, then yes, you should be getting some gold? What do you tell the people who say? But you know, all time highs, not just in the dollar, but in every currency on the planet, are marching towards $3,000 as we speak right now. That’s a lot of money, an ounce.

Well, the US government debt is increasing at a faster pace than the economy. So as that debt increases faster than the economy, you need people to buy that debt because the government’s borrowing money. Now, the number of people who’ve got the cash to buy that government debt will only increase at the speed of GDP, at the speed of the economy.

So as the debt is growing at a much faster pace, at some point, those people who would be natural buyers, when I say people, I mean corporations, pension funds, governments, and of course, private investors, at some point, they’re going to start to get indigestion. And they’ll be saying, we’re not going to buy any more debt at this price, because we’re holding too much already. So what then happens is the Treasury turns to the Federal Reserve and says, nobody will buy our debt at 5% interest rates or whatever it is that we’re willing to pay.

We need you to step in and help us. So what happens then, the Federal Reserve will print a whole load of money, print it, with which they’ll then buy indirectly through the primary dealers, of course, but ultimately, they’re effectively buying from the Treasury, all the new debt that the government wants to issue. But as the government prints that money, as the Federal Reserve prints that money, that basically is creating inflation at the short end, because it’s creating money supply.

Of course, we have another kind of inflation in the world, and that is to the extent the government borrows money at a faster and poorer rate, someone is getting the money that the government is borrowing to spend. So the government gets poorer, everybody else or someone else gets richer. And those people who are getting richer want something to spend their money on.

And they’re not necessarily going to want to put it all in Treasury bonds and bills where the debt is increasing at an ever increasing pace. They’re going to look for other things. And one of those things which they can put their money in to protect themselves against that inflation is, in fact, gold.

Of course, it won’t be the only thing. They’re going to put their money into works of art. They’re going to put their money into stock equities.

They’re going to probably buy Bitcoin. They’re probably going to buy property. They’ll buy anything which is wanted and in limited supply to protect the value of their wealth.

I read a very good commentary of yours, you know, specifically on the march, you know, this march that gold’s on and it’s towards higher prices. And you say, you know, forget all these these these talking points, you know, forget Trump, forget the tariffs, forget China. It really just comes down to mathematics for you.

So I just want to learn a little bit more from you of where you think, based on your findings, that gold could could go to here. Yeah. So at the moment, there’s a mathematical reason why the spot price of gold is being pulled higher.

And that mathematical reason is that the futures are at an unusually high level. So when the futures trade at a level which is higher than the gold price, that’s called a contango. Yes.

And as you approach the settlement month of the final day of the settlement, that contango drifts down from, let’s say, 10 or 20 dollars towards zero and ultimately hit zero on the final day of the contract. But what we’ve been seeing is a contango where the futures price is at a much higher price than would be expected according to what’s called the cost of carry. And the cost of carry, as far as gold is concerned, is to all intents and purposes, the interest rate on a three month Treasury bill, or it should be.

But this time it’s not. It’s much, much higher. So what’s that what’s happening, therefore, is that people are saying, if I can lay my hands on the right size bars, I can buy the spot bars, sell the future and make a contango or make an interest rate return, which is far higher than I can get on any other asset.

And there is zero risk because I own the gold. When it gets to spot month, I can deliver the gold. Zero risk.

So the question is, how high can it go? Well, I think you never know. The music carries on until it stops. But right now we have a clear situation that there are net buyers of gold out there.

And I think this is now starting to draw in, to a small extent, asset allocators from the big banks and investment managers who are starting to say, I’ve had a really good run with my max seven with my S&P 500. Is it time to take a little bit of money off the table and go into the next big thing? And I think that some of them are starting to allocate one or two or three percent to the gold market. And that, I think, is also it’s still very, very early.

There’s no evidence that’s happening yet because we don’t see large inflows into the gold ETFs. But I think it’s starting to happen a little bit. They’re picking up gold a bit left, right and center.

And it’s probably more in Europe than it is in America. But people are starting to buy that gold. And I think it could down the line turn into quite a rush.

So we might see a huge speculative move upwards in the price of gold. So how can it go? Well, Daniel, I don’t know. I mean, you can put any number under the sun.

You know, things can go to extreme levels when people get excited about something. The gold market, relative to other things, is a relatively small market. So in terms of what’s available to be sold at a certain price, because the central banks are going to be selling their gold at any price.

So it could go quite a long way if this plan by Bessant to monetize gold goes ahead. And when I say monetize, what that means is they would revalue gold for the official price of forty two dollars and twenty two cents to perhaps the market price or let’s call it three thousand or three thousand five hundred dollars, maybe, which is higher than the market price. What that would do would put a flaw under the gold price.

So let’s just say for illustration purposes, the government decides to do that. I’ll tell you why they’ll do it in a second. They revalue gold at a new official price of three thousand five hundred dollars.

What does that do? It puts a flaw under the gold price because the government is now standing ready to buy unlimited amounts of gold at three and a half thousand dollars. So you have no risk whatsoever if you buy gold when they’ve made that the official price, because they will buy unlimited amounts of gold at the official price. Of course, they won’t sell you any at the official price.

The question is, why would they put a new price on gold, a new official price? Well, the reason is if you change the price of gold from the forty two dollars and twenty two cents that is on the books at the moment to the market value, they are going to book a very large profit. So if they put it to, let’s say, two thousand nine hundred where gold is roughly now, then that’s about eight hundred billion dollars of profit, which. By calling it a profit, they can say that the budget deficit for the current year, at least, has been reduced.

So if they were to do this, the higher the gold price, the better, because the higher the gold prices, the more profit they’re going to make and the more they can say they’ve reduced the budget deficit. That doesn’t actually change anything about as far as the amount the government actually has to borrow. But it does make the official figures look much better than they really are.

And of course, that Mr. Trump, President Trump, can stand up and say, look, I’ve only been president for a year or two years, whatever it is. Look, the deficits down from two trillion to half a trillion or one trillion, whatever the figure will be. Question.

That’s an important point, because I had so many people calling me saying, yeah, if they revalue gold, I’m about to get wealthier. Nope, you’re not. So for current gold holders, it’s not going to make it’s not going to change anything for you.

If I’m hearing what you say correctly, it just helps the government, right? It just helps them doesn’t help, you know, regular gold holders. But if it’s that 800 billion, you say it helps the budget deficit, but it’s just it won’t help the national debt at all. It’s just like nothing.

The government will still. Well, yes, but maybe no. It all depends how they do the transaction.

Now, what one way of doing the transaction would be to say to the Goldman Sachs or Federal Reserve, we want you to monetize this for us. We want you to turn it into money. And we will not call.

So it could be we put the gold as security and borrow against it. That could be with the Federal Reserve. So but we work as as we have gold worth exactly the amount of that we borrowed.

We haven’t increased our debt at all, but we’ve increased our cash supply. So we don’t need to borrow. So even though they’ve borrowed, they borrowed against the gold, if you would be against the new official price.

So that doesn’t count. But they’ve got the cash. So they don’t need to borrow as much, according to the national debt.

So yes, they might. So if they do it as a that sort of transaction, it might well stop the debt from rising as much. Or the second way of doing it, which could help stop the debt from rising as much, is to say to the Federal Reserve, here you are.

We nicked this gold off you in 1934. How about you buy it back? How about you buy back what we took off you in 1934, buy it back at market price? And the Federal Reserve obediently, I’m saying this with a bit tongue in cheek because they’re supposed to be independent, agrees to buy the gold at $3,000 or $3,500 an ounce, printing the money. Now, the Treasury has got all that money, which is again, reducing the amount it needs to borrow.

And then, of course, down the line, a few years down the line, they can take the gold back from the Federal Reserve in exactly the way they did in 1934. They basically pass a bit of legislation to say it’s ours and they’ll take it off them at the current price and then they’ll revalue it to a higher price. All the profit accruing to the Treasury.

That’s what happened in 1934. And hence why you say you think this could happen, because it sounds like a great scenario for the government. Yeah.

I mean, it’s playing games, but that’s what governments have done. I mean, they did the same thing. We mustn’t forget this.

They did the same thing in the 1970s, I think it was 1972 or 1974, where they revalued gold first from $35 to $37 and then from $37 to $42.22. It wasn’t much then, but they booked about $2 billion of profit to their accounts, which they could then effectively spend. Same thing in 1934. On the 30th of January, they legislated that all the gold belonging to the Federal Reserve belongs to the United States.

Gold at that time was $20.67. So the Treasury issued the Federal Reserve with effectively what they called a gold note, but basically it’s nothing more than the bank note promising to pay them dollars at $20.67 per ounce, took all that gold in house at $20.67 and the very next day revalued at $35, making a mammoth great profit, all for the benefit of the Treasury. Upsetting, of course, the Federal Reserve, but not only the Federal Reserve was upset, but countries all around the world were upset, like the UK and the French, because suddenly all their dollars were worth nearly half as much. Because don’t forget gold was money and money was gold.

And suddenly you couldn’t get as much gold as you were entitled to with the money you had. Clive, the last talking point news item I want to bring up is, you know, obviously all this buzz surrounding auditing Fort Knox. Now I just had another great interview on this topic where the expert rightfully so brought up the fact that, well, okay, first of all, if you’re going to do an audit, it should be Fort Knox, West Point and the Fed Federal Reserve in New York where the gold is.

Two, even if we see the gold, it’s most likely there, doesn’t mean it’s owned by the government. We don’t know who really owns the gold or even the bigger point being, how many times was it sold and can they deliver? Yeah. So the lender of last resort for gold is the central bank or the government.

So when gold is needed, it can be lent out to bullion banks who then lend to, for example, gold miners who then instruct the gold to be sold and the ownership will change from the borrower to whoever the buyer is, maybe China or whatever. But that gold bar doesn’t actually have to change place. All that happens is the yellow sticker starts off by saying this gold belongs to the Treasury.

Three minutes later, this gold has been lent to JP Morgan. They owe it back to us, but we still got the bar. We’re safe as houses.

We’ve got the bar physically in our custody. It’s not left the house. And then it goes to the gold mining company.

Now we stick a sticker on it saying it belongs to Newmont Mining or Barrick or whoever has borrowed the gold. And then they sell it back to JP Morgan. Now it belongs to JP Morgan.

And eventually, six months down the line or two years down the line, the gold mining company digs up the gold, repays the gold that they borrowed to JP Morgan. JP Morgan then repays the gold to the Fed. All that happens is the sticker changes places.

The name of the sticker changes places. Now that could be what’s going on. We don’t know who has the legal possession of that gold, even though it might well be still physically stuck in Fort Knox.

But the ownership of it might be changing hands. So we don’t know. I mean, I’m speculating here.

This is an allegation by Gata, for example, that this gold has all been leased out and it may not come back. It’s speculation. But the only way to find out for sure is to go down there, not only count each bar and see who owns each bar and put it up on a blockchain with the number of the bar, but also each bar needs to be properly tested with today’s technology to make sure it really is gold.

And not tungsten. For example, because tungsten has the same specific gravity as gold. And one of the oldest tricks in the book used to be and still can be to fill a gold bar with a certain amount of tungsten and make a huge profit because it’s very difficult to tell the difference according to either the weight.

Obviously, you have the weight test, you have a specific gravity test. But these days, we have other tests. We have electromagnetic tests and radio wave tests, all sorts of things which can tell if the bar is consistently one metal or if there are two metals in it.

So these sort of tests couldn’t have been performed back in the 1930s and 40s when this gold was first put into the vaults. So I think it’s time to have a test and understand. I think the public wants to know, is the gold really there? And is it genuine? What would happen? But could you imagine, let’s play out that scenario though, Clive.

I mean, would they really let that news get out? Imagine we get in there and they test the gold and it’s not real gold or the gold’s not there. I mean, how would the public react? Well, I think the man in the streets could have shrugged his shoulders and say, I don’t care. We knew it all along.

But obviously, if you’re a large foreign government like China, you’re going to have a big smile on your face because you’re going to say we’ve got the gold and they don’t. And he who has the gold calls the shots when the monetary system has to reset. And we know that it’s only a question of time before we have some kind of reset of the currency, losers being those who hold the currency, those who hold the bonds, those who hold the cash.

Those are the losers. And when you have a reset, you’ve got to have something to back the new system. And probably it’s going to be gold.

So those who’ve got the most gold will be calling the shots. So if this happens, it probably will be time for it probably will cause a reset. There’ll be a big conference and all the nations of the world will get together to try and work out some solution for the way forward.

So the world can be reassured that once again, we have a currency which can be relied on for the purposes of international trade. Now, obviously, Americans would like that to be the dollar, but not every country thinks that that’s the way it should be. And if the Americans don’t have the gold, or if they don’t have enough gold, they may not be calling the shots next time.

There’s the big point. Last question on this, just to tie it all up here. Let’s say that gold was sold over and over, like you said, moving from JP Morgan to whomever.

When does it become a problem? When? When does it become a problem if the US were to have to sell the gold? Or if one of those entities wants to take physical delivery? I mean, when does it all come crashing down and really become an issue? Well, whatever happens, the USA is not going to sell its gold. That’s kind of kept as a last resort. You know, we saw that there was the pretense of for some decades from the 1930s to the 1970s, there was the pretense that America would deliver gold and settlement of its trade, its trading with foreign nations.

But obviously, when that became clear that it was unsustainable, they basically stopped doing it. So one would have thought the problem should have occurred in 1971, when America went off the gold standard. It didn’t.

And they’ve continued to expand the money supply, the debt by extraordinary amounts with no consequences. But the moment it becomes a problem is when there’s a loss of confidence in the currency. Now, the question is, would, in today’s world, a discovery that there’s not enough gold or it’s not there at all in Fort Knox, would that cause a loss of confidence in the US dollar? You can’t tell.

I don’t see particularly why, but certainly foreign nations are less likely to hold the dollar in such circumstances. They’re going to say, ah, that’s the excuse we’re looking for, not to hold any more dollars. Jolly good, let’s go buy Bitcoin or gold or property or copper or nickel or whatever they decide to invest in.

Fascinating insights, as always. Wow. Talk about a deep dive.

Look, there’s a lot of crazy stuff happening in gold right now. That’s one thing that’s for sure. Clive, thank you so much.

Thank you, Daniela, for having me on your show. Much appreciated. And we’ll have more great content coming your way.

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